Focusing on Ma Duanlin's ideas of the fengjian and junxian systems, this article discusses the literati's thinking about state-society relations during the Song-Yuan transition, and on this basis examines the appropriateness of applying a “state vs. society” framework to study Song history. Ma opposed fengjian and supported the junxian system. He argued that the fengjian system required the “impartial mind” of the ruler in order to operate properly, a condition that no longer existed after the Three Dynasties. Junxian thus became the only practical form for political power after the Qin and Han periods. However, as a junxian state's ability to control society had innate limitations, Ma argued that the state should not interfere in society's activities too much. But he still thought that the state should lead society based on its superior capacities, while society should provide capable literati to join the government. The state-society relationship imagined by Ma falls into a harmonious and complementary “state-literati-society” framework. Perhaps we may call this kind of state a “leader state.” This concept was popular among the contemporary literati.